[Csnd-dev] Hosting CsoundVST and vst4cs binaries again

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[Csnd-dev] Hosting CsoundVST and vst4cs binaries again

Michael Gogins-2
No response to my query. I have updated my reasoning a bit based on
further reading. There is no substantial change to my conclusion. We
are permitted to host binaries for CsoundVST and the vst4cs opcodes on
AppVeyor and GitHub.

However, we need to change the wording of the license text in our
source code in the frontends/CsoundVST and Opcodes/vst4cs to add a
exception that permits users of that code to license it as LGPL v2.1
even if they compile it with VST2 SDK sources, as follows (worded for
vst4cs):

//  The vst4cs library is free software; you can redistribute it
//  and/or modify it under the terms of the GNU Lesser General Public
//  License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either
//  version 2.1 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.
//
//  The vst4cs library is distributed in the hope that it will be useful,
//  but WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of
//  MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE.  See the
//  GNU Lesser General Public License for more details.
//
//  You should have received a copy of the GNU Lesser General Public
//  License along with the vst4cs library; if not, write to the Free Software
//  Foundation, Inc., 59 Temple Place, Suite 330, Boston, MA
//  02111-1307 USA
//
//  Linking vst4cs statically or dynamically with other modules is making a
//  combined work based on vst4cs. Thus, the terms and conditions of the GNU
//  Lesser General Public License cover the whole combination.
//
//  In addition, as a special exception, the copyright holders of vst4cs give
//  you permission to combine vst4cs with free software programs or libraries
//  that are released under the GNU LGPL and with code included in the
//  standard release of the VST SDK version 2 under the terms of the license
//  stated in the VST SDK version 2 files. You may copy and distribute such a
//  system following the terms of the GNU LGPL for vst4cs and the licenses of
//  the other code concerned. The source code for the VST SDK version 2 is
//  available in the VST SDK hosted at
https://github.com/steinbergmedia/vst3sdk.
//
//  Note that people who make modified versions of vst4cs are not obligated to
//  grant this special exception for their modified versions; it is their
//  choice whether to do so. The GNU Lesser General Public License gives
//  permission to release a modified version without this exception; this
//  exception also makes it possible to release a modified version which
//  carries forward this exception.

Unless I hear objections, in the next few few days I will add this
license text to CsoundVST and vst4cs and enable the VST features in
the AppVeyor build and the AppVeyor-built Windows installer.

The complete text of my reasoning is attached.

Best,
Mike

-----------------------------------------------------
Michael Gogins
Irreducible Productions
http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com
Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com

licensing_considerations_for_csoundvst_and vst4cs.md (22K) Download Attachment
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Re: [Csnd-dev] Hosting CsoundVST and vst4cs binaries again

Steven Yi
Hi Michael,

Your last message posted to Github is quite long and a lot to process.
From what I understood, it sounds like everything is good to move
forward.  (With obligatory, I am not a lawyer...). My main concern was
that this build would be host-able at Github, which it sounds like it
is.  So I'm a +1 for it to go forward.  Worst case if there's any
complaints we can take down and modify things easily.

Thanks,
steven


On Fri, Sep 22, 2017 at 12:50 PM, Michael Gogins
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> No response to my query. I have updated my reasoning a bit based on
> further reading. There is no substantial change to my conclusion. We
> are permitted to host binaries for CsoundVST and the vst4cs opcodes on
> AppVeyor and GitHub.
>
> However, we need to change the wording of the license text in our
> source code in the frontends/CsoundVST and Opcodes/vst4cs to add a
> exception that permits users of that code to license it as LGPL v2.1
> even if they compile it with VST2 SDK sources, as follows (worded for
> vst4cs):
>
> //  The vst4cs library is free software; you can redistribute it
> //  and/or modify it under the terms of the GNU Lesser General Public
> //  License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either
> //  version 2.1 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.
> //
> //  The vst4cs library is distributed in the hope that it will be useful,
> //  but WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of
> //  MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE.  See the
> //  GNU Lesser General Public License for more details.
> //
> //  You should have received a copy of the GNU Lesser General Public
> //  License along with the vst4cs library; if not, write to the Free Software
> //  Foundation, Inc., 59 Temple Place, Suite 330, Boston, MA
> //  02111-1307 USA
> //
> //  Linking vst4cs statically or dynamically with other modules is making a
> //  combined work based on vst4cs. Thus, the terms and conditions of the GNU
> //  Lesser General Public License cover the whole combination.
> //
> //  In addition, as a special exception, the copyright holders of vst4cs give
> //  you permission to combine vst4cs with free software programs or libraries
> //  that are released under the GNU LGPL and with code included in the
> //  standard release of the VST SDK version 2 under the terms of the license
> //  stated in the VST SDK version 2 files. You may copy and distribute such a
> //  system following the terms of the GNU LGPL for vst4cs and the licenses of
> //  the other code concerned. The source code for the VST SDK version 2 is
> //  available in the VST SDK hosted at
> https://github.com/steinbergmedia/vst3sdk.
> //
> //  Note that people who make modified versions of vst4cs are not obligated to
> //  grant this special exception for their modified versions; it is their
> //  choice whether to do so. The GNU Lesser General Public License gives
> //  permission to release a modified version without this exception; this
> //  exception also makes it possible to release a modified version which
> //  carries forward this exception.
>
> Unless I hear objections, in the next few few days I will add this
> license text to CsoundVST and vst4cs and enable the VST features in
> the AppVeyor build and the AppVeyor-built Windows installer.
>
> The complete text of my reasoning is attached.
>
> Best,
> Mike
>
> -----------------------------------------------------
> Michael Gogins
> Irreducible Productions
> http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com
> Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com
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Re: [Csnd-dev] Hosting CsoundVST and vst4cs binaries again

Michael Gogins-2
Thanks for your response. When you look into the issues in detail, it
becomes clear that not all projects, nor all developers, are equally
well informed. Also, there definitely are grey areas in the GPL,
notably whether a shared library that is loaded at run time creates a
"derived work" with its host. FSF says yea, others say nay. I will
continue to look into this a bit before I push anything. I'm examining
the JUCE forums (JUCE is the closest analogy to Csound but is GPL v3),
the VST SDK forums, the details of the VST3 SDK code, and the GPL
documentation, as well as other open source or free software VST
plugins.

What does seem clear to me is that are fewer problems sticking with
the VST2 SDK because that lets all of Csound remain LPGL v2.1.

-----------------------------------------------------
Michael Gogins
Irreducible Productions
http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com
Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com


On Fri, Sep 22, 2017 at 2:14 PM, Steven Yi <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi Michael,
>
> Your last message posted to Github is quite long and a lot to process.
> From what I understood, it sounds like everything is good to move
> forward.  (With obligatory, I am not a lawyer...). My main concern was
> that this build would be host-able at Github, which it sounds like it
> is.  So I'm a +1 for it to go forward.  Worst case if there's any
> complaints we can take down and modify things easily.
>
> Thanks,
> steven
>
>
> On Fri, Sep 22, 2017 at 12:50 PM, Michael Gogins
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> No response to my query. I have updated my reasoning a bit based on
>> further reading. There is no substantial change to my conclusion. We
>> are permitted to host binaries for CsoundVST and the vst4cs opcodes on
>> AppVeyor and GitHub.
>>
>> However, we need to change the wording of the license text in our
>> source code in the frontends/CsoundVST and Opcodes/vst4cs to add a
>> exception that permits users of that code to license it as LGPL v2.1
>> even if they compile it with VST2 SDK sources, as follows (worded for
>> vst4cs):
>>
>> //  The vst4cs library is free software; you can redistribute it
>> //  and/or modify it under the terms of the GNU Lesser General Public
>> //  License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either
>> //  version 2.1 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.
>> //
>> //  The vst4cs library is distributed in the hope that it will be useful,
>> //  but WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of
>> //  MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE.  See the
>> //  GNU Lesser General Public License for more details.
>> //
>> //  You should have received a copy of the GNU Lesser General Public
>> //  License along with the vst4cs library; if not, write to the Free Software
>> //  Foundation, Inc., 59 Temple Place, Suite 330, Boston, MA
>> //  02111-1307 USA
>> //
>> //  Linking vst4cs statically or dynamically with other modules is making a
>> //  combined work based on vst4cs. Thus, the terms and conditions of the GNU
>> //  Lesser General Public License cover the whole combination.
>> //
>> //  In addition, as a special exception, the copyright holders of vst4cs give
>> //  you permission to combine vst4cs with free software programs or libraries
>> //  that are released under the GNU LGPL and with code included in the
>> //  standard release of the VST SDK version 2 under the terms of the license
>> //  stated in the VST SDK version 2 files. You may copy and distribute such a
>> //  system following the terms of the GNU LGPL for vst4cs and the licenses of
>> //  the other code concerned. The source code for the VST SDK version 2 is
>> //  available in the VST SDK hosted at
>> https://github.com/steinbergmedia/vst3sdk.
>> //
>> //  Note that people who make modified versions of vst4cs are not obligated to
>> //  grant this special exception for their modified versions; it is their
>> //  choice whether to do so. The GNU Lesser General Public License gives
>> //  permission to release a modified version without this exception; this
>> //  exception also makes it possible to release a modified version which
>> //  carries forward this exception.
>>
>> Unless I hear objections, in the next few few days I will add this
>> license text to CsoundVST and vst4cs and enable the VST features in
>> the AppVeyor build and the AppVeyor-built Windows installer.
>>
>> The complete text of my reasoning is attached.
>>
>> Best,
>> Mike
>>
>> -----------------------------------------------------
>> Michael Gogins
>> Irreducible Productions
>> http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com
>> Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com
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Re: [Csnd-dev] Hosting CsoundVST and vst4cs binaries again

Steven Yi
Certainly an exhausting task; thanks Michael for digging into all of this!

On Fri, Sep 22, 2017 at 3:37 PM, Michael Gogins
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> Thanks for your response. When you look into the issues in detail, it
> becomes clear that not all projects, nor all developers, are equally
> well informed. Also, there definitely are grey areas in the GPL,
> notably whether a shared library that is loaded at run time creates a
> "derived work" with its host. FSF says yea, others say nay. I will
> continue to look into this a bit before I push anything. I'm examining
> the JUCE forums (JUCE is the closest analogy to Csound but is GPL v3),
> the VST SDK forums, the details of the VST3 SDK code, and the GPL
> documentation, as well as other open source or free software VST
> plugins.
>
> What does seem clear to me is that are fewer problems sticking with
> the VST2 SDK because that lets all of Csound remain LPGL v2.1.
>
> -----------------------------------------------------
> Michael Gogins
> Irreducible Productions
> http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com
> Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com
>
>
> On Fri, Sep 22, 2017 at 2:14 PM, Steven Yi <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Hi Michael,
>>
>> Your last message posted to Github is quite long and a lot to process.
>> From what I understood, it sounds like everything is good to move
>> forward.  (With obligatory, I am not a lawyer...). My main concern was
>> that this build would be host-able at Github, which it sounds like it
>> is.  So I'm a +1 for it to go forward.  Worst case if there's any
>> complaints we can take down and modify things easily.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> steven
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Sep 22, 2017 at 12:50 PM, Michael Gogins
>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> No response to my query. I have updated my reasoning a bit based on
>>> further reading. There is no substantial change to my conclusion. We
>>> are permitted to host binaries for CsoundVST and the vst4cs opcodes on
>>> AppVeyor and GitHub.
>>>
>>> However, we need to change the wording of the license text in our
>>> source code in the frontends/CsoundVST and Opcodes/vst4cs to add a
>>> exception that permits users of that code to license it as LGPL v2.1
>>> even if they compile it with VST2 SDK sources, as follows (worded for
>>> vst4cs):
>>>
>>> //  The vst4cs library is free software; you can redistribute it
>>> //  and/or modify it under the terms of the GNU Lesser General Public
>>> //  License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either
>>> //  version 2.1 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.
>>> //
>>> //  The vst4cs library is distributed in the hope that it will be useful,
>>> //  but WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of
>>> //  MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE.  See the
>>> //  GNU Lesser General Public License for more details.
>>> //
>>> //  You should have received a copy of the GNU Lesser General Public
>>> //  License along with the vst4cs library; if not, write to the Free Software
>>> //  Foundation, Inc., 59 Temple Place, Suite 330, Boston, MA
>>> //  02111-1307 USA
>>> //
>>> //  Linking vst4cs statically or dynamically with other modules is making a
>>> //  combined work based on vst4cs. Thus, the terms and conditions of the GNU
>>> //  Lesser General Public License cover the whole combination.
>>> //
>>> //  In addition, as a special exception, the copyright holders of vst4cs give
>>> //  you permission to combine vst4cs with free software programs or libraries
>>> //  that are released under the GNU LGPL and with code included in the
>>> //  standard release of the VST SDK version 2 under the terms of the license
>>> //  stated in the VST SDK version 2 files. You may copy and distribute such a
>>> //  system following the terms of the GNU LGPL for vst4cs and the licenses of
>>> //  the other code concerned. The source code for the VST SDK version 2 is
>>> //  available in the VST SDK hosted at
>>> https://github.com/steinbergmedia/vst3sdk.
>>> //
>>> //  Note that people who make modified versions of vst4cs are not obligated to
>>> //  grant this special exception for their modified versions; it is their
>>> //  choice whether to do so. The GNU Lesser General Public License gives
>>> //  permission to release a modified version without this exception; this
>>> //  exception also makes it possible to release a modified version which
>>> //  carries forward this exception.
>>>
>>> Unless I hear objections, in the next few few days I will add this
>>> license text to CsoundVST and vst4cs and enable the VST features in
>>> the AppVeyor build and the AppVeyor-built Windows installer.
>>>
>>> The complete text of my reasoning is attached.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> Mike
>>>
>>> -----------------------------------------------------
>>> Michael Gogins
>>> Irreducible Productions
>>> http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com
>>> Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com